[Mishka]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lowem', 'E')xactly. Sometimes I wonder why I have to drag my ass to the office every day (I'm a Java/J2EE software engineer). It's about 20 km (12 miles) away, about half an hour's drive in good conditions, a little longer if the roads are congested.

Today, I am at home for awhile, on medical leave. I can access the company servers via VPN; the software makes my home PC appear as a node on the office network. The upstream is a bit slow, but all they have to do is to pay a little bit for more bandwidth and we'd be all set.

I can reach across the network, deploy applications, debug, trigger an automated build, transfer files back and forth. I can check my email, I can send and receive instant messages, I can, if I want to, chat on Skype with my colleagues in the China and USA offices.

About the only thing missing is the "enormous" 100 Mbps bandwidth on the local area network, but if you consider that the office rental is in the 5-digit range and 4-digits will get us a very, very good high-speed link ...

Okay, some people talk about the "human factor" and all that, yeah, maybe, but since when did we geeks need to worry about "human factor" - well, perhaps a smaller office for us to do F2F meetings once a week or two, with a limited number of cubicles and seats.

[Bytesmiths]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('bentstrider', 'I')f you could find a diesel, then that wouldn't be a problem.
Biodiesel is easier to make then you think.

[gwmss15]

How to move people and food arond the country using the least amount of oil to do thats easy :


the answer is simple USE a Electic Powered TRAIN to move the people and the food this has been done before all over the world

SO STOP DRIVING and USE A TRAIN OR TRAM and you will get you oil saving you need to save the worl

[Bytesmiths]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gwmss15', 'U')SE a Electic Powered TRAIN to move the people and the food this has been done before all over the world

SO STOP DRIVING and USE A TRAIN OR TRAM and you will get you oil saving you need to save the worl

[bentstrider]

You got that right.
I recently acquired a Class A CDL here in CA.
Even though those trucks had big ass fuel tanks, that was only to compensate for the ass fuel economy they got.
7 whole mile per gallon.
The only reason I stopped trucking though was because of having ot deal with those scales and DOT.
Maybe I'll put in an application to BNSF, UP, CSX, Conrail, CN, or one of those big railroad companies.
Because for all intesive purposes, trains were whooping everyones ass, even before oil came to be.

[big_rc]

Another example of why Peak Oil is going to hit the US in the behind super hard. Check out some of these commutes. So much for simplification.

Commutes from hell

[gwmss15]

in victoria there are a few thoursan people that commute on a train from a small poluted town 250 KM from melbourne every day it take them about 2 and half hours ie they leave tralogon station at 5.05am and arrive melbourne around 8.35 am if its ontime and when this train pass my train it si normaly standing room they have 3 6 car trips in the morning to melbourne and 4 6 car trips back in the night

so long commute in australia is common i think the average is 60 mins but a lot do over 90mins each way mainly by train and tram

[mgibbons19]

Ppl are foolish. When are they going to look at it and see that they simply cannot win playing by those rules?

Simply foolish. Maybe I can sell them a car.

[tmazanec1]

Mar 14 - Apr 8 will feature big time commuting for me (not really doable by bus, with my schedule and the bus routes) . Well, at least it will be over in a few weeks!

[some_guy282]

Just curious, how many miles is the commute?

[tmazanec1]

Not sure of the miles. To work I go from Maple Heights to Garfield Heights. During the training period I will move to Garfield Heights so work and errands are closer. But for the training it will be Maple Heights - Warrensville Heights - Shaker Heights - Cleveland Heights - East Cleveland and on to almost CWRU campus. Fortunately most of the route is one LONG street (I tend to get lost fairly easily).

[gwmss15]

do you know if theres a train or tram service within 1 mile of the campus

also if there is a train station is there a feeder bus to it have you tried to ring up the private bus company that runs the bus routes in that area to get a timetable plus does your city have a metro hotline and website that can give you timetable and route info eg like www.metlinkmelbourne.com.au for my city or like www.transperth.wa.gov.au

give them a try to find out more before you resort to long taxi trips

[tmazanec1]

I don't believe so. Also, I have to get to work ASAP from the training...no time for waiting for busses and transfers.
It is likely not much longer in milage than the trips I make to my aunt's house a few times a year. At least I only have to do it 20+ times (the plus is for "practice runs) and then it is on to actually LESS gas usage per month (except visiting my father...but I doubt that will add much)!

[jmacdaddio]

I live in NJ just a few miles from where I work. I drive maybe 50 miles a week for commuting and maybe another 100 for personal use. I get gas twice a month, and sometimes only once in a month. Most other people I know get gas every fourth day or thereabouts.

About 10 yrs ago when I entered the work force I realized that lots of folks were commuting in to NYC and the northern NJ industrial and office park areas from as far away as the Pocono mountains in PA, Putnam County in NY, and Toms River at the Jersey Shore. Now since not everyone on this board is from NJ, those areas are approximately 75 miles due west, 50 miles north, and about 75 miles south of NYC. The decreased housing costs, lower property taxes, and hypothetical "quality of life" improvements made it worthwhile to live in those far-flung areas and drive well over an hour each way to a job.

Most folks who do the long drives are doing it for noble reasons - more room for kids to play, better schools, more house per dollar for growing families. I've resisted the temptation to do the same because when gas hits $5 a gallon in the US suddenly there will be a lot of folks who are desperate to ditch their homes in those brand-new exurban subdivisions, not to mention the Expeditions and Hummers sitting in the driveways, and I don't want to be one of them, not that I'd have an Expedition or Hummer in my driveway even if I did have a house in an exurban subdivision.

IMHO an economic system which makes it feasible for someone to own a massive home in a new subdivision and drive 70 miles each way for a middle management position in an office park is insane and I am sure others on this board feel this outrage. In a way we're all paying for it because their choice to use all that gasoline affects us all through global warming. When you add in the cost to US taxpayers to invade Iraq and maintain a far-flung military presence to keep the oil flowing, suddenly $5 gas sounds like a bargain.

My apologies for turning this post into a classic rant ... myself, I'll try not to gloat at all the long-haul commuters when gas prices start marching up.

[nero]

The price of gas has to go way up to make the cost of the commute prohibitive. Even at 5 dollars a gallon the price of a 150 mile round trip commute is only around 27 dollars per day (27.5MPG). With an office job in the city this will still be affordable. So people who have good jobs will still be able to afford to commute. It will still make sense to some to make that commute, 27 dollars a day translates into over 500 dollars a month on gasoline for the commute. That is about the equivalent of an extra hundred thousand dollars on your mortgage. So to make it economic to move to within easy public transit distances from work you have to find a comparable place close to the city that is less than 100,000 dollars more expensive than the track housing out in the sticks. I am not familiar with the housing market in NYC but that doesn't sound realistic.

5 dollar a gallon gas would have some significant economic effects but I don't think it would change suburban life. People could compensate quite alot simply by buying more fuel efficient cars. I believe Europe already experiences these prices and there are Europeans living in suburbs with long commutes.

[some_guy282]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('nero', 'T')he price of gas has to go way up to make the cost of the commute prohibitive. Even at 5 dollars a gallon the price of a 150 mile round trip commute is only around 27 dollars per day (27.5MPG). With an office job in the city this will still be affordable. So people who have good jobs will still be able to afford to commute. It will still make sense to some to make that commute, 27 dollars a day translates into over 500 dollars a month on gasoline for the commute. That is about the equivalent of an extra hundred thousand dollars on your mortgage. So to make it economic to move to within easy public transit distances from work you have to find a comparable place close to the city that is less than 100,000 dollars more expensive than the track housing out in the sticks. I am not familiar with the housing market in NYC but that doesn't sound realistic.

5 dollar a gallon gas would have some significant economic effects but I don't think it would change suburban life. People could compensate quite alot simply by buying more fuel efficient cars. I believe Europe already experiences these prices and there are Europeans living in suburbs with long commutes.

[arretium]

I think Kunster is on to something regarding our suburbian society. In the reader's digest version of the reader's digest version of his book the Long Emergency, he states that our economy is now built on the continued expansion of the suburbs. When gas hits $5 a gallon, the suburbs will hit a break wall. Probably before that price, but $5 is a nice number, right? Once it costs $30 to feed your car to drive to your $120/day (gross) job, most people won't be able to afford it. Sure the middle managers can, but most of America makes far less than a middle manager.

Once it becomes exorbantly expensive to commute to work, that's when you'll see the whole society hit the preverbal brick wall.

[some_guy282]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('arretium', 'I') think Kunster is on to something regarding our suburbian society. In the reader's digest version of the reader's digest version of his book the Long Emergency, he states that our economy is now built on the continued expansion of the suburbs. When gas hits $5 a gallon, the suburbs will hit a break wall. Probably before that price, but $5 is a nice number, right? Once it costs $30 to feed your car to drive to your $120/day (gross) job, most people won't be able to afford it. Sure the middle managers can, but most of America makes far less than a middle manager.

Once it becomes exorbantly expensive to commute to work, that's when you'll see the whole society hit the preverbal brick wall.

[JohnDenver]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('some_guy282', 'A')s far as your #'s on money spent on gasoline and mileage...you're kidding, right? The average suburban commuter isn't driving a car with 27 mpg. They're not even driving a car with 20 mpg. They're driving SUV's with about 12mpg. So you can take the estimates you made on how much they'll be spending for gasoline, and more than double them. That's $1,000 extra spent a month on gasoline, and an extra $12,000 spent a year on transportation costs. There is no way in hell the average suburban commuter will be able to keep that up - they simply wont be able to afford it. Something will have to give.

[some_guy282]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JohnDenver', '
')
I still don't understand all the hysteria about this situation. I can think of lots ways of solving the problem off the top of my head: moving nearer to work, negotiating a telecommuting agreement with your employer, buying a scooter, staying at a flop-house near work during the week, car-pooling etc.

You can pocket most/all of $12,000 simply by dealing with some minor inconveniences, but we can't really expect anyone to cope with inconvenience in exchange for a large sum of money.