$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('doufus', '
')It's called a switch. Turn off your F-n aircons, mansions of lights,
deep fried every f-n thing, 3000 entertainment appliances, 3 TVs,
3 computers, 84 kitchen gizmos, electric can openers (oh fer
F*(* sake!), electric toothbrushes (oh no....), and then there's
that thing you drive that most armies would mount a cannon
on to justify the fuel burn.
Most of all get off yer fat arses and walk or ride. You may have less
diabetes and heart disease that way. You might even be able to
save shitloads of energy in the manufature and distribution of the
drugs and medication you need to keep your obese bodies alive.
You bitch about fuel costs and yet i bet you pay more for orange
juice and a bottle of water.
Grow up. PO isn't the end of civilisation. It's the end of a lifestyle-
yours!
PeakOil is You
Peak Oil is Contrived!
Re: Peak Oil is Contrived!
by Ludi » Sun 13 Nov 2005, 05:35:27
Are you aware that not everyone lives the way you characterize above? I sure don't. You seem to be advocating conservation as the solution. What about those who have very little they can cut out of their "lifestyle?" What if they have already cut back? Cut back more you say? That means a decrease in the standard of living. Which is what many doomers say is going to happen, with or without conservation. So, if you're advocating decreasing the standard of living, you're agreeing with the doomers.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Montequest', 'T')he inevitable die-off necessitated by overshoot will apply differently depending upon where you are in the Petri dish. In the third-world, the inability to purchase or grow food will cause starvation, malnutrition, and markedly increase the death rate. Many starving countries rely on exports of cash crops to survive. They won’t be able to afford IMF debt, nor the energy required for irrigation, petrochemicals, or fertilizers.
In the 1st world, our standard of living will decline markedly. In some ways, modern civilization has allowed us to redirect or satisfy the desire to reproduce by allowing us to acquire things—material possessions—in place of having children. Our "material infant mortality" will increase dramatically. I see an end to NASCAR and long commutes, long-haul trucking, and an implosion of our urban sprawl and financial systems. Unemployment will rise beyond belief. People will have to actually work for a living, rather than live off investments.
This might seem, in principle, an alternative to the more literal form of die-off which is an abrupt increase in human mortality. Of course, there will be a lack of available, affordable medical care, resulting in a lower life expectancy. Poorer diets will also lower life expectancy. As the standard of living declines, more of the lower income and elderly will starve, freeze to death, or die from heat exhaustion, as do every year. Depending upon the rate of decline of available energy, the attrition could be slow or quite fast.
At first, we will live off conservation and efficiency, and then we will work down through our standard of living until such time as a balance will once again be achieved with nature. Will we be able to find sustainability along the way and bring our population under control? Will we quickly evolve a new economy and a new basis for civilization—or continue to secure stable supplies from the rest of the world by force, as the military footprint in the Middle East suggests.
We can hope to soften the shock, but unless there is a general awakening and decisions at the planetary scale to bring radical change in the domain of energy, civilization will confront the most acute and no doubt most violent upheaval in recent history. This unavoidable prophecy is being universally ignored, denied, or underestimated. Rare are those who realize exactly how close and how great is its advent.
http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic10962-0.html
- Ludi
Re: Peak Oil is Contrived!
by orz » Sun 13 Nov 2005, 05:48:53
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')re you aware that not everyone lives the way you characterize above? I sure don't. You seem to be advocating conservation as the solution. What about those who have very little they can cut out of their "lifestyle?" What if they have already cut back? Cut back more you say? That means a decrease in the standard of living. Which is what many doomers say is going to happen, with or without conservation. So, if you're advocating decreasing the standard of living, you're agreeing with the doomers.
I know at least 10 towns full of people who live as he described. Sure my evidence is anecdotal, but then again, so is yours.
But seriously, I really doubt that even 80% of the energy we use in the US is completely necessary to maintain our standard of living. Though on this issue, I agree that, there will be some significant lifestyle changes, at least for awhile.
-
orz - Peat
- Posts: 117
- Joined: Sat 05 Nov 2005, 04:00:00
Re: Peak Oil is Contrived!
by Ludi » Sun 13 Nov 2005, 05:59:04
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('orz', '
')But seriously, I really doubt that even 80% of the energy we use in the US is completely necessary to maintain our standard of living. Though on this issue, I agree that, there will be some significant lifestyle changes, at least for awhile.
')But seriously, I really doubt that even 80% of the energy we use in the US is completely necessary to maintain our standard of living. Though on this issue, I agree that, there will be some significant lifestyle changes, at least for awhile.
Our standard of living is based on discretionary spending to a large degree. That excess energy use translates to someone else's job. What will all the unemployed people do? "Something else" I guess. Like "be homeless."
- Ludi
