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Page added on December 13, 2018

Why is it so Easy to Lie to Us? The Case of Russia and Climategate

Our media feed us routinely with lies and the story of the involvement of the Russian Secret Service with the Climategate hack is just one of them. I thought it was worth discussing it here in light of the fact that it is one of the most blatant lies I could ever find. Also a good illustration of the incredible persistence of legends in the mediasphere.

Last week, I cited the Climategate story, noting how it was part of a wide-ranging anti-science propaganda effort and that it must have involved some professional hacking work to break into the server of the East Anglia University. On that point, I received a comment from “Andy Mitchell” that went as:

The Climategate hack has only one suspect: the Russian Petrostate. There are no other suspects.

Note the absolute certainty of this statement: it is a typical characteristic of legends. So, I thought it was intriguing enough to deserve a little examination.

The origin of the story of the involvement of Russian Secret Services with Climategate is easy to find: it is an article of the Daily Mail dated 6 December 2009. Then, debunking legends normally takes a little work but, in this case, it is remarkable how there is nothing to debunk: the Daily Mail article contains no facts, no evidence, no data.

You can read the article yourself, and you’ll be amazed at how obvious it is that it is something invented out of whole cloth. The only vague connection with reality is that the Climategate files may have been stored for a short time in Tomsk, a Russian town. And, of course, these Russian hackers must be very smart and yet they didn’t think that storing their data in a Russian server would have pinpointed the origin of the hack to the even smarter journalists of the Daily Mail!

Among the funniest things of the article, one is the mentioning of “a leading world expert on the subject [climate change], Professor Sergei Kirpotin” who said strictly nothing about the hacking story, but whose large size picture appears in the article. Apparently, they had to reach a certain length for their piece and they couldn’t find anything better than that. I can imagine that they reasoned in terms of something like “he’s Russian, he says something about climate, so he will fit in.” That shows, incidentally, what they think of the level of intelligence of their readers.

As I said, this is a vintage story, but we can learn something from it just because ten years have passed from its first appearance in the memesphere

1. Lies appearing in the mainstream media can be invented out of nothing — they don’t need to be connected in any way with reality. The fact that they appear on a tabloid, the Daily Mail, well known for being unreliable (including telling us of a restaurant selling human meat in Nigeria) means little or nothing. It is sufficient that the legend agrees with some well known perception, in this case, that the Russians are evil and deceptive, as well as our enemies.

2. There was no significant attempt to debunk the story in the Western Press. It was reproduced nearly verbatim in other press outlets, the Telegraph, for instance. Even the Guardian reported the story as an attack of the Russian secret services. I couldn’t find skeptical comments to these stories: maybe they were censored or, simply, there were none.

3. Legends are also unbelievably persistent. The rumor that the Russians created the Climategate scandal keeps reappearing. In 2016, Mother Jones ran an especially convoluted piece in which they tried to demonstrate that, since the Russians had hacked the 2016 US elections, then it was also true that they had created the Climategate scandal seven years before (or, perhaps, the reverse: since they had created the Climategate scandal, then it was believable that they had hacked the US elections). Legends can reinforce each other, independently of whether they are based on something real or not.

This story is impressive not so much because it is false. For what I know, the hackers who created the Climategate story could come from anywhere in the world — they might have been Russian, why not? It would change nothing to the fact that it IS easy to lie to us. It carries no penalties and the most outrageous lies will be normally believed by almost everybody. Our media have been lying to us, they keep doing that, and they will continue to do that. There is a problem, though: associations based on lies can’t last very long, be they marriages, business agreements, or whole societies. Empires based on lies are destined to fall. It happened in the past and it may well happen to us in the near future.

Cassandra’s legacy by Ugo Bardi

23 Comments on "Why is it so Easy to Lie to Us? The Case of Russia and Climategate"

Outcast_Searcher on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 12:48 pm

The world is complex. We all rely on various experts to tell us “the truth”. No one has the expertise, time, energy, resources, etc. to check everything they consume, much less hear.

Do you check all your food, medications, etc. for poison or proper potency, etc?

I just read that Walmart and Target are being sued for selling Children’s toys with lead. Is every retailer required by law to check every item they sell? Are the suppliers who sell them to the retailers? etc? If so, how much does that raise prices for all that extra protection?

I’m not saying that it’s OK for politicians, businesses, etc. to lie to us. I’m saying that given how hard it would be to verify everything in the modern world, even if people were well educated and able to judge things like scientific and mathematical and economic facts well — it would still be difficult to consistently know if one was being lied to.

Outcast_Searcher on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 12:49 pm

As far as politics, which lies are being told is largely a matter of whose lips are moving, and what their agenda is. This is remarkably similar to product marketing, which is why I pay basically no attention whatsoever to ads, unless I’m actively researching a purchase. And then I’m skeptical and seek out multiple sources, reviews, etc.

JuanP on Sun, 26th Jun 2016 12:22 am on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 6:52 pm

As far as I am concerned human beings are a bunch of arrogant and retarded ignorant fools and they deserve what’s coming. Call me selfish if you want, I don’t give a fuck!

Davy Intentity Theft on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 6:54 pm

JuanP on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 6:52 pm

makati1 on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 8:25 pm

Lies are old news. This is new news:

“Fentanyl now America’s deadliest drug, federal health officials say”

“Fentanyl is now the deadliest drug in America, federal health officials announced Wednesday, with more than 18,000 overdose deaths in 2016, the most recent year for which statistics are available….”

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2018/12/12/fentanyl-now-america-deadliest-drug-overtakes-heroin/2287343002/?utm_source=feedblitz&utm_medium=FeedBlitzRss&utm_campaign=usatoday-newstopstories

“Tool Of Terror”: This Killer Opioid Could Be Used As “Weapon Of Mass Destruction”

“Fentanyl is so powerful that a few milligrams can be fatal. It would take about 40 pounds of fentanyl to kill everyone in New York City and 1,515 pounds to kill almost all Americans.”

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-12-13/tool-terror-killer-opioid-terrorizing-us-and-could-be-used-next-attack

The US is going down.

makati1 on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 11:51 pm

“The idiots take over in the final days of crumbling civilizations….There is a familiar checklist for extinction. We are ticking off every item on it….Donald Trump is the face of our collective idiocy….This moment in history marks the end of a long, sad tale of greed and murder by the white races…. Europeans and Americans have spent five centuries conquering, plundering, exploiting and polluting the earth in the name of human progress….

Magical thinking is not limited to the beliefs and practices of pre-modern cultures. It defines the ideology of capitalism….All of our systems of information, from self-help gurus and Hollywood to political monstrosities such as Trump, sell us this snake oil. We blind ourselves to impending collapse….

Half the country may live in poverty, our civil liberties may be taken from us, militarized police may murder unarmed citizens in the streets and we may run the world’s largest prison system and murderous war machine, but all these truths are studiously ignored. Trump embodies the essence of this decayed, intellectually bankrupt and immoral world. He is its natural expression. He is the king of the idiots. We are his victims.”

https://www.truthdig.com/articles/reign-of-idiots/

https://www.truthdig.com/author/chris_hedges/#author-bio

Nuff said. Slip slidin’,,,

Makati1 on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 11:54 pm

Nuff said is right. JuanP is making me feel like this board is no longer worth visiting.

Makati1 on Thu, 13th Dec 2018 11:55 pm

slipslidin””

Theedrich on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 5:40 am

As with Rome, our republic is turning monarchic. In the last century B.C., Rome’s oligarchs had amassed incredible wealth to the impoverishment of the vast majority of the people. A series of civil wars led to various strong men rising and falling, culminating in Julius Caesar, the conqueror of Gaul and other lands. He was assassinated in 44 B.C. on March 15 — the Ides — because he was perceived by the Republicans (the Optimates, or “Best Ones”) as acquiring royal power, a no-no to the super-rich. For a short while it looked like the Res Publica might be restored to the status quo ante. Then Mark Antony, Caesar’s “vice president” (associate consul) took over and continued Caesar’s policies, besides pursuing and defeating the murderers. The attorney-politician Marcus Tullius Cicero, a Republican, attacked Mark Antony viciously in a brilliant series of fake-news diatribes known as the “Philippics,” for which Mark Antony subsequently had him executed and his head and right hand displayed in the city main square, or forum. Later Octavian Augustus, Caesar’s adopted nephew, took over and defeated Mark, who committed suicide, as also his lover, Cleopatra, did later. For the next five centuries Rome was ruled by strong men (imperatores, “commanders”).

In short, the forces of history simply overwhelmed the “democratic” structures of early Rome. The ever-growing elites brought about an imbalance of socio-economic factors which made “government of the people, by the people, for the people” impossible.

Today we find that history is rhyming with that ancient, convulsive conversion. Our empire can no longer stand the strain of globalizing multi-billionaires impoverishing the proletariat. Thus we find the Democrat Party in the role of the Republican Optimates of old, run behind the scenes by men and organizations of untold wealth, as the masses sink into ignorance, sloth and parasitism.

The signs of decay are multitudinous. Consider the striking changes of behavior and outward appearance among the people in the last few decades: it is considered “chic” to appear and dress like a bum, with members of both sexes deliberately wearing shabby clothes, often with holes or tears in them; many men go about half-shaven and often bald as though to show how “manly” they are; tatoos and metallic “piercings” have become ubiquitous on both exposed and covered parts of the body; and most disgusting and dangerous of all, is the explosion in opiate addiction, which is enriching narcotics gangs in Mexico, China and elsewhere.

The hordes are distracted from awareness of their own demise by artificial cultural conflicts pushed by the oligarch-owned media. Even so, many have become disgusted with the stagnation and high-level corruption of the American system. Now, siren calls for some form of Communism (“socialism”) are being listened to by the young, especially on taxpayer-supported college campuses where study-averse students amass vast debts learning all about gender studies and White guilt before dropping out without graduating. In addition, the oligarchs need more slave labor, which they import from outhouse mudlands or hire cheaply in East Asia. The whole idea of preventing racial miscegenation is the worst thing they could think of for their bottom lines, and must be nipped in the bud by nightly TV tirades about racism, the “Holocaust,” American “values,” etc., etc. And, of course, such lectures are often accompanied by fear-inducing stories about The Threat posed by Russia.

Last but not least, since we now see Democrats (like the Roman Optimates) using government agents and agencies to destroy their populist Trumpian enemies, we can expect that, after some modern version of an Ides-of-March event, there will be chaos resulting eventually, and one way or another, in an emperor.

Because history does rhyme.

Davy on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 5:59 am

“Today we find that history is rhyming with that ancient, convulsive conversion. Our empire can no longer stand the strain of globalizing multi-billionaires impoverishing the proletariat. Thus we find the Democrat Party in the role of the Republican Optimates of old, run behind the scenes by men and organizations of untold wealth, as the masses sink into ignorance, sloth and parasitism.”

Thee, we are not quite there yet but this is the direction most major powers are heading in. Russia is already a mafia state. China has an Emperor. The US somewhat of the Republicans you mention but you forgot to add to the Democrats, the Republicans. Republicans are from the same tree.

DerHundistLos on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 8:10 am

“Last but not least, since we now see Democrats (like the Roman Optimates) using government agents and agencies to destroy their populist Trumpian enemies.”
~~~Theedrich~~~

Sorry, Theedrich, but the American public ain’t buying. For it’s the American public that destroyed your version of a Trumpian utopia—- at the ballot box the Democratic resistance voted in unprecedented numbers for a Midterm election. Democratic candidates received as many votes this year (63 million) as the 63 million that President Trump received in 2016. There isn’t any precedent for the opposition party at the midterm equaling the president’s vote total.

Further complicating your narrative is the topic of the future for Midterm voters aged 18 to 29 chose Democratic candidates by an astonishing 35 points, a record margin for the youth vote.

Davy on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 8:22 am

“Clinton Foundation Whistleblowers Testify: “It Operated As An Unregistered Foreign Agent”
https://tinyurl.com/ycq94evr

“The Clinton Foundation operated as a foreign agent ‘early in its life’ and ‘throughout it’s existence’ and did not operate as a 501c3 charitable foundation as required, and is not entitled to its status as a nonprofit, alleged two highly qualified forensic investigators, accompanied by three other investigators, said in explosive testimony Thursday to the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee. John Moynihan and Lawerence W. Doyle, both graduates of the Catholic Jesuit College of the Holy Cross and former expert forensic government investigators, gave their shocking testimony before congress based on a nearly two year investigation into the foundation’s work both nationally and internationally. They were assisted by three other highly trained experts in taxation law and financial forensic investigations. The forensic investigators stressed that they obtained all the documentation on the foundation legally and through Freedom of Information Request Acts from the IRS and other agencies.”

“Doyle and Moynihan have amassed 6,000 documents in their nearly two-year investigation through their private firm MDA Analytics LLC. The documents were turned over more than a year and a half ago to the IRS, according to John Solomon, who first published the report last week in The Hill. “The investigation clearly demonstrates that the foundation was not a charitable organization per se, but in point of fact was a closely held family partnership,” said Doyle, who formerly worked on Wall Street and has been involved with finance for the last ten years conducting investigations. “As such it was governed in a fashion in which it sought in large measure to advance the personal interests of its principles as detailed within the financial analysis of this submission and further confirmed within the supporting documentation and evidence section.”

I AM THE MOB on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 9:14 am

Davy

Enough with Hillary Clinton..You deranged lunatic..And you call other people extremist..

Nobody is dumber than you..You are just like clogg you can only site sources from the fringe corners of the internet..

Intelligence Study Links Low I.Q. To Prejudice, Racism, Conservatism
https://www.scribd.com/document/394515778/Bright-Minds-and-Dark-Attitudes-Lower-Cognitive-Ability-Predicts-Greater-Prejudice-Through-Right-Wing-Ideology-and-Low-Intergroup-Contact-Hodson-an?fbclid=IwAR26r5rWH5_03picXqUHgtyRtKDJ0NOmoVO-fBFp4dQY85O-mF6PA9lAkdI

I AM THE MOB on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 9:17 am

Attention Doomie prepper and permies!

Prepping is futile

Myth: Well-prepared individuals, groups, and communities will survive our impending collapse and maintain healthy, fulfilling, and productive lives in its aftermath.

Reality: Those who survive our collapse will be those who can obtain sufficient life sustaining essentials—especially clean water and food—on a continuous basis, both during and after collapse. Those who store large quantities of these essentials and those who attempt to produce food, either individually or in communities, will be easy targets for the vast majority who have neither the foresight to store nor the skills to produce. No matter how remote or secluded your sanctuary, somebody will know about it; and they will come to call when they become desperate; and they will be well armed and devoid of compassion. You can prepare for a last stand, but you cannot prepare for post-collapse survival. Post-collapse Life Will Be Preferable to Our Industrial Lifestyle Paradigm

Myth: Industrialization has brought nothing but misery and degradation to the human race; our quality of life (and spiritual wellbeing) will improve substantially in a post-collapse world.

Reality: The post-collapse lifestyle awaiting the few who survive will, under the best of circumstances, share many attributes with pre-Columbian America. Unfortunately, the realities associated with subsistence level existence bear little semblance to the Hollywood accounts. Those who anxiously await our post-collapse world will be disappointed, assuming they live to experience it. The fact that nobody is opting to jettison the amenities afforded by an industrialized way of life in favor of a hunter-gatherer lifestyle today should be sufficient proof that our future way of life is not something to be anticipated. Industrialism is not inherently “evil” or immoral; it is simply physically impossible going forward.

I AM THE MOB on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 9:23 am

We Might Not Have Enough Materials for All the Solar Panels and Wind Turbines We Need

Davy on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 9:55 am

MOB, too much to handle? When your identity is based on something so corrupt and disgusting it has to be a shock.

I AM THE MOB on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 9:59 am

Davy

I have no identity based on anything..I am sick of your spamming conspiracy theories..You are as stupid as clogg..

Open your mind and read from different sources..But you can’t because you need a source that caters to your distorted worldview.

Davy on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 10:20 am

Sure you do MOB. It is plain as day and the more self defensive you become the more nailed you are. You are still an undeveloped mind raw but rotting.

I AM THE MOB on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 10:43 am

How Putin and the Far Right Played the Paris Yellow Vests Protests

Russia didn’t trigger the Gilets Jaunes. But Putin and the far right want to see Paris burn and Europe weakened and divided, so they jumped at the chance to contaminate and manipulate them

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/.premium-how-putin-and-the-far-right-played-the-paris-yellow-vests-protests-1.6743555

Well see about that Putin..we already have our missile defense blocking anything Russia could shoot..

All we need is a false flag and then Mother Russia will be done!

Davy on Fri, 14th Dec 2018 11:38 am